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Re: Republicanism still an ...

paulh
SubjectRe: Republicanism still an offence in England? (wasRe: Queen mother (of
Frompaulh
Date2002-04-18 18:46 (2002-04-18 18:46)
Message-ID<2fttbugj5r8md6n1dm17hq7518r85ck5dn@4ax.com>
Client
Newsgroupsalt.fan.tolkien
FollowsRuss

On 18 Apr 2002 04:03:27 GMT, mcresq@aol.com (Russ) wrote:

paulh
There seems to be this belief that because we have a word, Terrorist, that therefore we should also have a one sentence easy definition of what it means that, when applied, easily seperates all the Terrorist organisations from all the Revolutionary ones. I doubt that there is such a definition. And therefore you have to make a decision yourself,

Russ
So we're back to the root: they are terrorists because you say they are...

And your response is better?. You seem to think that the IRA aren't terrorists as a matter of fact but you haven't provided one shred of non-subjective fact that they aren't. You can't measure Terrorism based on a physical measurement, despite your attempts to do so. Its always subjective. You have got a bunch of figures, layed them down and pointed at one column and said "X=Y therefore I've decided that that means they're not terrorists" but somewhat naively believe that thats an objective measurement.. but it aint. I doubt there anything I could say to change your view or you could do to change mine. Cos they're ultimately opinions, and ones based on such complex data that we can both choose (as we do) to see the path through to whatever answer we seek. Your faith in your ideas as being anything other than your own opinion seems somewhat 'idealistic'.

paulh
or on a communal basis as to what a Terrrorist organisation is. AFAIK Australia defines the IRA as a Terrorist organisation and so do I.

Russ
...or becuase your government says they are.

Well no... I've made my own mind up...

paulh
I can't help it if someone else doesn't based on their definition of the word. Thats why this is often a futile argument.But to use a statistic on deaths to prove it seems abhorrent to me.. as if there is a specific ratio of dead people that once met excuses a groups actions.

Russ
No, but it may mean they are not terrorists. I have not argued their ration of military vs civilian deaths excluses the IRA's actions and object to your characterization. What I have argued is that it's highly relevant to the question of whether they are terrorists or not. I specifically said their use of force was unjust, except in the beginning; that's a different issue as to whether they are terrorists.

They're undoubtedly succesful terrorists operationally, far more efficient than ME terrorists who haven't figured out what a PR War actually is. They've completely failed to achieve any particular strategic objective though, as far as I can see. Personally I think they shoulda stayed home, made babies and in 100 years the point would be moot as the catholics outbred the protestants.

paulh