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Re: spreadsheet ergonomics

Sandman
SubjectRe: spreadsheet ergonomics
FromSandman
Date04/04/2017 08:28 (04/04/2017 08:28)
Message-ID<sandman-4397c010bde3c77edf85cdc3a457701a@individual.net>
Client
Newsgroupscomp.os.linux.advocacy
PGPSandman
FollowsSnit
FollowupsSnit (9h & 34m) > Sandman

In article <D50846D1.9C951%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>, Snit wrote:

Sandman
What is the quantifiable measurement of my "obsession" this time? Can't be "responses" because you respond to me as much as I do to you. Can't be "mentions" because you mention me far more than I mention you.

So what is it, then? In what way can you show me that I am more obsessed about you than you are about me?

Snit's response: *silence*

Snit
If those who troll COLA are not obsessing over me, lying about me, and begging for my attention then why are there so many examples of them doing so?

Sandman
Unsubstantiated claim #1

Snit
It is a direct response to you trolling and doing as I say!

Sandman
Unsubstantiated claim #1

Snit
Seriously, what more "substation" do you need?

Sandman
Yeah, you know... *actual* substantiation. Instead of that thing you do when you can't support something... What was it... Yes - just make claims using empty words! That's the thing.

Snit
So specifics examples proving my point are deemed insufficient to you.

Your "specific example" is you making an empty claim about the action of another person. You are again confusing "claims" with "substantiation".

This is part of your problem: you just make mindless accusations and then demand I work to refute them... ignoring how you were just proved wrong.

Sandman
Only, I make claims and I support them. You make claims, full stop. Huge difference.

Snit
Ah, so let us talk about one of your tech claims. Show your HTML file with this line:

<div style="padding: 3px; align: center;">

And then explain why you think it would validate correctly. Or explain why it did not have that line when the WBM shows it as having it, consistently, for some time before that date.

I would sincerely love to hear you explain your side of the story. No insults. No accusations. Just a talk of the technology you say you used at the time.

I did, at the time, remember?

Sandman Re: Maccies aren't fanatical? 06/01/2006 <mr-4E1B8E.08284701062006@individual.net>

"It hasn't. It's dynamically constructed though, so it's not residing within a static text file. You would have known this if you had looked at the code."

You even acknowledged it:

Snit Re: Proof Sandman keeps running from. 07/31/2009 <C69893D3.3F21B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>

"I noted that your homepage did not validate correctly. As you note, your site has lots of dynamic features, including the CSS. When you checked, maybe it did. Instead of just saying that, you accused me of lying."

Only, I of course did say exactly that.

Yet here you are, 11 years later still posting about this. Still lying about this. Still dragging it up as often as you can:

Can you make livi... 2017-04-04 <D5081427.9C8DF%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> spreadsheet ergon... 2017-04-04 <D5081593.9C8E4%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> spreadsheet ergon... 2017-04-04 <D5081630.9C8F1%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Can you make livi... 2017-04-04 <D5081639.9C8F2%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> spreadsheet ergon... 2017-04-04 <D5081BF6.9C90F%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Can you make livi... 2017-04-04 <D5081FA5.9C916%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> spreadsheet ergon... 2017-04-04 <D5084099.9C943%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> spreadsheet ergon... 2017-04-04 <D50846D1.9C951%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Can you make livi... 2017-04-04 <D50847CD.9C953%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> spreadsheet ergon... 2017-04-03 <D5070554.9C63F%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> spreadsheet ergon... 2017-04-03 <D507DCE6.9C718%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Can you make livi... 2017-04-03 <D507DDD4.9C71B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Can you make livi... 2017-04-03 <D507DEE3.9C727%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> spreadsheet ergon... 2017-04-03 <D5080C11.9C8A1%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Can you make livi... 2017-04-02 <D506702E.99482%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Can you make livi... 2017-04-01 <D5052C59.9934D%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Can you make livi... 2017-04-01 <D5054836.9937C%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Can you make livi... 2017-04-01 <D5054AF6.9937F%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Can you make livi... 2017-03-31 <D50401A6.99192%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit self-nuke fo... 2017-02-21 <D4D1BF4D.90DC9%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit self-nuke fo... 2017-02-21 <D4D1D256.90E03%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit self-nuke fo... 2017-02-21 <D4D1ABEE.90D7F%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman's obsessi... 2017-02-21 <D4D1AD22.90D84%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman's obsessi... 2017-02-21 <D4D1EFD3.90E33%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit self-nuke fo... 2017-02-21 <D4D1ACF7.90D82%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman's obsessi... 2017-02-21 <D4D1AD0B.90D83%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Blast from the pa... 2017-02-21 <D4D0F016.90CF0%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Blast from the pa... 2017-02-21 <D4D0EF76.90CEA%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Blast from the pa... 2017-02-21 <D4D0EF2E.90CE9%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit self-nuke fo... 2017-02-21 <D4D1EA26.90E28%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman's obsessi... 2017-02-21 <D4D1D031.90DF7%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit self-nuke fo... 2017-02-21 <D4D1CFF8.90DF6%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman's obsessi... 2017-02-21 <D4D1CBD2.90DEA%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> OT: I have Dunni... 2017-02-19 <D4CF3BC2.9098F%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Dan Purgert OS X ... 2017-02-18 <D4CDDF07.90775%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman does not ... 2017-02-18 <D4CDE9CB.907A5%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-17 <D4CBAFA6.90476%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-17 <D4CB8F18.90441%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-17 <D4CBACD7.9046D%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-17 <D4CC72EA.9054B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-17 <D4CC72EF.9054B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-16 <D4CB1A09.902F9%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-16 <D4CB233B.9032A%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-16 <D4CB3F78.90375%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-16 <D4CB459D.9038D%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-16 <D4CB5EBF.903D5%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-15 <D4CA29AB.901A7%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-15 <D4CA29CC.901A8%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-15 <D4CA2A08.901A9%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-15 <D4CA2949.901A5%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-15 <D4C9EE03.900FC%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit busts Steve ... 2017-02-15 <D4C9FCB9.9013B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-15 <D4CA004F.90149%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-15 <D4CA2613.90192%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> February 14th is ... 2017-02-15 <D4CA277F.90194%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-14 <D4C7F2EF.8FDA4%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> HTML isn't C++. 2017-02-14 <D4C7F2E2.8FDA3%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-14 <D4C7EE91.8FD97%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit Wins again. ... 2017-02-14 <D4C7EF09.8FD98%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Munich expected t... 2017-02-14 <D4C7F484.8FDAD%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-14 <D4C7EF35.8FD9A%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> [Troll] Somethin... 2017-02-14 <D4C8A186.8FE8F%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-14 <D4C8A583.8FEA5%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-14 <D4C8AA37.8FED4%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit https://yout... 2017-02-14 <D4C8B281.8FEF6%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Donald Trump File... 2017-02-14 <D4C8C0A2.8FF2D%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C6408D.8FA53%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C64099.8FA54%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C640A1.8FA55%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-13 <D4C72162.8FB8D%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-13 <D4C721B2.8FB8F%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C721E6.8FB90%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-13 <D4C722B0.8FB96%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C72548.8FB9B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-13 <D4C73068.8FBAF%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C73072.8FBB0%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-13 <D4C73084.8FBB5%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-13 <D4C73554.8FBC6%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C73582.8FBC7%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C73AA8.8FBDF%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C73BCF.8FBE1%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> HTML isn't C++. 2017-02-13 <D4C73F67.8FBF8%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C745B9.8FC15%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Marek Novotny doe... 2017-02-13 <D4C74C6E.8FC31%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-13 <D4C74C95.8FC34%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-13 <D4C74CBA.8FC37%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-13 <D4C76B4C.8FC99%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit Destroys San... 2017-02-12 <D4C4F4BD.8F821%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-12 <D4C4F4DB.8F823%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-12 <D4C4F614.8F827%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit's google-see... 2017-02-12 <D4C52762.8F88A%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-12 <D4C5E398.8F90B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Steve Carroll "Tr... 2017-02-12 <D4C5E576.8F914%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> We are pulling fo... 2017-02-12 <D4C5E8D7.8F92D%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-12 <D4C6005E.8F985%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-12 <D4C6006A.8F987%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-12 <D4C6008A.8F98B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-12 <D4C60200.8F9A3%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit Destroys San... 2017-02-12 <D4C5E3CD.8F90D%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-12 <D4C60249.8F9A5%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Peace offering fo... 2017-02-12 <D4C63015.8FA21%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-11 <D4C3A157.8F6D3%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-11 <D4C47639.8F73B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-11 <D4C48BB8.8F770%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-11 <D4C4AFA7.8F79E%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-11 <D4C4D05D.8F7E1%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-11 <D4C4D0E2.8F7E4%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Snit Destroys San... 2017-02-11 <D4C4D3F8.8F7F9%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> More than a decad... 2017-02-11 <D4C4D12A.8F7E8%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-10 <D4C38D28.8F69B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-10 <D4C38DD7.8F69D%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-10 <D4C24DEE.8F4D7%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Poll: Snit Leaves... 2017-02-10 <D4C24E95.8F4D9%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-10 <D4C330F4.8F5BE%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-10 <D4C33164.8F5BF%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-10 <D4C33DA0.8F5E2%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-10 <D4C345F5.8F5FD%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-10 <D4C351C6.8F613%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-10 <D4C35C15.8F641%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-10 <D4C37C1B.8F676%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-09 <D4C1079B.8F281%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-09 <D4C136DF.8F2E1%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-09 <D4C136FD.8F2E2%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-09 <D4C13765.8F2E5%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-09 <D4C137E4.8F2E7%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-09 <D4C137F1.8F2E8%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-09 <D4C1FE12.8F408%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-09 <D4C23525.8F49F%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-09 <D4C23D0E.8F4BB%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Poll: Snit Leaves... 2017-02-08 <D4BFAA5B.8EF15%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-08 <D4C0C38D.8F1D8%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-08 <D4C09A90.8F165%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-08 <D4C0A6FC.8F184%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-08 <D4C0B70A.8F1B0%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-08 <D4C0C24D.8F1D6%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Sandman still lyi... 2017-02-08 <D4C0C490.8F1DC%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Poll: Snit Leaves... 2017-02-07 <D4BF4908.8EDFB%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Organizing Docume... 2017-02-06 <D4BD6987.8EA7C%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Poll: Snit Leaves... 2017-02-06 <D4BD7681.8EA96%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Finding An Altern... 2017-02-01 <D4B68C8E.8CB87%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Mint... now with ... 2017-01-31 <D4B65E8B.8CAE3%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> LO with embedded ... 2017-01-17 <D4A2C505.8AC2B%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> The Reason I Can'... 2017-01-14 <D49F1FF9.8A5B3%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> LibreOffice: just... 2017-01-10 <D499AC60.87641%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Color picker 2017-01-10 <D49A8F07.87738%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> Current list of t... 2017-01-09 <D499140A.87501%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>

And with that, I will let you freak out and troll COLA while I focus, mostly, on tech. You have bored me out of your BS.

Sandman
You say "mostly", what percentage of your posts will be trolling then?

Snit
Do you count my responding to your trolling and the trolling of others as me, also, trolling?

While I'm sure you have responded to people trolling you, I can't remember having seen any such posts for quite a while. Your response to that Gohde post about your wife would match that. Only, you responded by lying to it, so not sure it really counts.

But no, I am in reference to your trolling. When you post lies about others, when you make unsubstantiated claims, post insults, role reversal, misinterpretation, misinformation etc etc. Every single post between you and I after you failed the challenge is the result of me correcting a lie on your part about me, in a post not directed to me.

Sandman
I welcome any initiative from you that makes you focus *only* on tech.

Snit
Sure. First we need to understand the two categories almost all my posts fit into:

1) Talking about tech

Apart from during the challenge - a very low amount. But there is no dispute of this definition. If you're talking about tech, you're talking about tech. Sure, sometimes you weave in your trolling agenda slowly and steadily when the topic was tech-related from the beginning. Usually in the nature of small "challenges" for your "opponent".

2) Responding to the trolling of you and others

Again, this you rarely, if ever, do. Meaning that the only one in the entire group that claims you do this is you. No one else is agreeing with you about this. No one would step in here and say "yeah, Snit may troll now and then but most of the time he is just responding to the trolling of others". So even *IF* you actually believe that is what you do, that doesn't make it so.

If you want me to talk more about tech, then stop yourself trolling me and work to reduce others. Boom. Once I have less trolling to respond to I will respond to less of it.

I correct your lies and misinformation about me, remember? Again ALL the posts between you and I after you failed your challenge is a direct result of you posting lies *about me* in posts *not directed towards me*. Where I had to step in and expose and correct your lies and misinformation. I didn't go around reading your posts starting to respond to you just to supposedly "troll" you.

Sandman
Why would you want to focus on anything but?

Snit
I have answered this question many times: I find the psychology of those of you troll COLA (and elsewhere) to be interesting. Your recent frenzy, for example, has been amazing. I will say it has gotten a bit long and you have sunk to your normal empty-knee-jerk-accusations, but even then it is interesting, on some level to see how predictable you will be.

Insult #1

You have already started using your automated trolling tools

Lying #1

(the ones you deny exist but have shown examples of how you use them!)

Lying #2

What you will NOT do is actually respond to any real issue, especially a tech one.

You'd have to post about tech for me to respond to it. As it is, I am only able to counter your lies and trolling because that's all you do at the moment.

You will also, as you have already stated, just deny all evidence, even direct and specific examples, which prove you wrong and even get to the point of whining I am just copying and pasting text in response to the examples.

If you don't want your trolling exposed, stop trolling. Perhaps you should start focusing only on tech instead? How's that for an idea?

You will NEVER admit that the examples I am showing you are, well, what they are. You will lie.

"Examples" aren't substantiation. When you make a claim that "X does Y" you are free to do so, but without substantiation, meaning a verifiable quote of X doing exactly Y without it being merely your interpretation of X doing Y, then it is unsubstantiated and just empty words.

I tell you these things in the interest of seeing if even knowing how predictable you are will you be able to stop yourself. I suspect no... you will do exactly what I say, or very close to it.

I will continue to track and expose your trolling for as long as you keep trolling, yes. If you want it to stop, maybe focus on tech instead?

Sandman
Why set up a wiggle room?

Snit
For what?

For trolling.

Sandman
Just focus on tech, we know that means that interest about you dies down, it has been shown.

Snit
Well, when I respond less to your trolling and the trolling of others those of you who troll do not have those posts to respond to.

Wait, did you just read what you wrote? Now, if these supposed "trolls" were indeed obsessed with you, why would they need your "responses" to keep "trolling" you? Are you saying that their supposed obsession is dependant on you *responding* to them? I mean, when you started to talk about tech for three weeks, they didn't respond to you, or hardly ever even mentioned you. Yet for some reason you here admit that this supposed "obsession" is a direct result of your interaction with these people.

This could have been a momentary lapse of reason on your part, even though your labelling of the posts is a bit backwards.

You seem to understand that this is 100% in your control, that your interaction with the regulars, and HOW you interact with them is what determines the animosity level against you, regardless of hat you label each person.

I better save this to the quote file :)

No mystery there! But that does not really show your obsession is any less. In fact, when I a month without posting at all I was still the most talked about poster.

Unsubstantiated claim #1

When you chose to talk about tech for three weeks, you were hardly even mentioned. Interest about you dwindled and no one cared. If people were supposedly "obsessed" with you the amount of mentions would be the same. If people were actually "trolling" you they would continue to do so regardless of what you were talking about.

Sandman
Again, with that pesky thing called 'substantiation'.

Snit
It is something you struggle with...

Lying #3

the accuse me of it as you engage in what you call role reversal.

Lying #4

-- Sandman

Snit (9h & 34m) > Sandman