-hh
Brake Dive, Acceleration Squat, Body Roll Works LLC wrote:

Alan Baker
[...]

Brake Dive, Acceleration Squat, Body Roll Works LLC
Agreed. I guess few people care if awd actually works otherwise haldex based cars would not sell nearly as well.

-hh
Yes, because the generic consumer doesn't care anymore: its classical 'Market Forces' and the consumers believing that they need feature X when they don't generally do, so the consumer never learns if the X they bought was a shitty version or a good version that merits differentiation.

A lot of this in the USA was due to factors of (cheap gas + marketing/profits + Govt Regulations) which conspired to drive a huge increase in the number of SUVs/Light Trucks being purchased...from roughly 5% to 50% since 1990.

However, this huge increase was not aligned with a commensurate increase in the consumer use cases which call for this type of vehicle as the solution. As such, the consumer is buying a product with features XYZ but really only using Y...the rest of the attributes are because they think they need them, or they're lazy, etc. They get XYZ because the OEMs are good at marketing, packaging and upselling.

For example, there was a consumer survey done several years ago where one of the key questions they asked was "How often do you take your vehicle off-road?". 95% of the respondents answered "Never".

With this sort of consumer behavior, it then isn't surprising that the resulting market forces steered itself away from locking hubs and manually engaged cases to "Automatic Everything' conveniences which had been promised by the OEMs to be "Just as Good" (even when it was not so).

Nashton
Well, if you don't, which most people don't, why would anyone care if they don't drive it on the track?

Brake Dive, Acceleration Squat, Body Roll Works LLC
Because I do not go to the track. I do not want understeer on public roads. I want car to turn pronto without an input lag worthy of ios 7 on iphine 5Cheap. Baker have explained in excruciating detail in another post in this thread that no matter how much you mash the fucking go pedal in a turn you only will be greeted with understeer in turns....

-hh
FYI, you apparently missed the posts where Nashton revealed that he's just a "mash the pedal" straight-line type. Feel free to ask him why - - despite his prior declarations - - he's now spent more than $70K for a vehicle that cannot do 0-60mph in < 6sec.

Brake Dive, Acceleration Squat, Body Roll Works LLC
Right, I don't want an understeering bulldozer regardless whether it's 4pot turbo mazdaspeed or a 6 pot boat anchor of maxima. Thanks.

-hh
BTW, any idea how far down the Autobahn's social hierarchy list that a Nissan would be? The lists that I've seen only cover the big five German brands (P-MB-BMW-A-VW).

After all, Q7 Maxima Boy here has claimed that he purchases his Marquees based on their heritage and prestige too.

Nashton
OK, but you don't know what kind of condition we deal with up here. It's abysmal. Especially since budget cuts have made road maintenance a non priority. I would have loved to get a Q50, but I'd be digging myself out of ditches and worse.

Brake Dive, Acceleration Squat, Body Roll Works LLC
Why?

-hh
Good question, since it has AWD and he's previously claimed that his job is such that he doesn't need to leave home on days with lousy weather. Better pull up the popcorn to kick back for this little show ;-)

Nashton
And an A4 is hardly conducive to transporting more than 2 people and very small kids in the back.

Brake Dive, Acceleration Squat, Body Roll Works LLC
Yes. It's a challenge. It's easier to do in your maxivan. Thank you Captain Obvious again for stating this.

Nashton
Well, we are discussing cars and I happen to own-sorry, drive one. Why would I not bring it up? Especially since i consider it to be the best compromise on the market today for my needs?

Brake Dive, Acceleration Squat, Body Roll Works LLC
Mostly because X5 makes a better sense for lease. Given the audi attentition to zincing the chassis rust through perforation might have been deciding factor if you wanted Q7 for keeps, but you don't, so competing bmw product makes a whole lot of sense (because it's probably more fun to drive and is about the same money)...

-hh
Of course, an actual minivan would offer even better people hauling utility, but it wouldn't be as marquee-prestigeous or as fun/engaging of a drive. Of course, an A6 or a 335GT would be better still, and without the whining of insufficient back seat legroom even for adults.

Brake Dive, Acceleration Squat, Body Roll Works LLC
unless you are in the same predicament as I am == few bmw dealers in the neighbourhood == high probability of receiving shitty service in some dept some day and having nowhere to turn.

-hh
Well, this does apply for him for Audi ... he barely has one choice within an hour's drive.