Eric Stevens
A global text search of this news group shows that I am the only person who has used the words 'software development' in this thread. Certainly Tony has not. If you want to claim otherwise you will have to cite the relevant articles.

Sandman
Paintshop and Corel 11/25/2013 <m3o699lcu5nkmjftqpss3pdj3bvv0mfkfg@4ax.com>

"When the steps are determined by the developer, and written into the program, a protocol has been established so the action will always be the same. That's a protocol."

You're welcome.

Eric Stevens
Neither the words "software development" nor "software" are used in the article you have just cited.

Sandman
But *still* unsubstantiated by you, in relation to the claim you made. Refering to a supposed "majority of people" you claim to speak for has no relevancy at all. Substantiation for your claim has relevancy.

Eric Stevens
I have several times showed you by both explanation and example where you are going wrong.

Sandman
This is a lie, Eric. You have NOT showed any examples that have shown that I do not understand the meaning of the word "protocol". You have, however, shown ample of proof that you do not, such as this:

Paintshop and Corel 11/28/2013 <gpgf99pcs9vdum7gifh0bnjc18ti5pbfk0@4ax.com>

"The user's backup protocol for the single button backup might say (....) or 'I'm never going to use it'"

You have yet to show ANY substantiation of me not understanding the word "protocol". You have an empty claim that I don't understand it, but you have yet to point to any information *from me* that you can claim is an incorrect claim about the meaning of "protocol", as I just did about you above. See - above is *substantiation*. I claim that you don't know the meaning of the word "protocol" and then I substantiate that with a quote from you where you clearly display this fallacy.

Eric Stevens
If it was a class room I would chalk up a diagram setting out the hierarchy of instructions which define the difference between a protocol and a procedure (software implements a procedure to meet the requirements of a protocol). As this is not a classrroom I will have to leave you to think about this yourself.

All you have done is deny that I am right.

Sandman
Since you have failed to support your claim, there is nothing for me to deny - you have yet to make a valid claim, just an empty one. Why would I deny your ampty claims?

Eric Stevens
You failing to understand does not mean that I have failed to support my claim.

Your refusal to accept any explanation does not amount to lack of substantiation by me.

Sandman
No, your refusal to substantiate your claim amounts to lack of substantiattion from you.

You have yet to:

1. Establish something I said that demonstrates a lack of understanding of the word "protocol"

2. Supply a correct definition or usage of the word in that context

I eagerly await your substantiation, Eric.

Eric Stevens
You have already the necessary explanations. If this were a class room with you having to sit an examination at the end of the year I would predict you will fail to answer this question correctly.

As it is, you are locked into a logical loop. In demanding examples which meet your requirementts you arefusing to understand the current use of the word 'protocol' until you understand the currrent use of the word 'protocol'.

Sandman
Ironic for you to claim that, since it was Tony that brought it up, not me.

Eric Stevens
Again, a global text search of this news group shows that I am the only person who has used the words 'software development' in this thread. Certainly Tony has not. If you want to claim otherwise you will have to cite the relevant articles.

Sandman
This is actually quite a bit funny. Your initial claim (still quoted above) was that *I* was going on about "software development", and I (correctly) pointed out that it was Tony that brought it up in the first place.

Eric Stevens
And I correctly pointed out that I was the first to use that term. You certainly talked about 'software developing'. I don't know who first introduced the subject of software developing/development.

Sandman
Now you've gone and seem to claim that the phrase should be verbatim just to shoot down my claim that it was Tony who brought it up (since he didn't use the exact phrase "software development") but what does that make out of your initial claim since you in the process have proved that.. neither have I.

So - Eric, why are YOU going on about "software development"??

Eric Stevens
Because you said (above) "he had started to talk about it".

I am sure there are pedople in this news group who know exactly what I mean by the 'black box' analogy.

Sandman
I know exactly what you mean by it - But what it does NOT is either of these:

1. Prove that I have misunderstood the word "protocol" 2. Define the word "protocol".

It does NEITHER of those things, which menas that in terms of substantiating your claim - it was just a lot of hot air.

Eric Stevens
The fact that continue to talk about 'software' (which is inside the black box) while Tony is referring to 'protocol' (which is outside the black box and determines what the black box is supposed to do) shows that you do not understand what is being said to you.

They will also know what I mean by a transfer function. You will be doing yourself no good in their eyes in taking the stand you have, stubbornly refusing to consider the idea.

Sandman
Hey, I am not the one that doesn't understand the word "protocol", like you've shown that you don't, Eric. Your irrlevant diversions about a black box analogy does not help you, but rather illustrate your ignorance.

Eric Stevens
Fail.

Your determination to maintain that you are correct prevents you from learning anything new.

Sandman
Correct about what? In contrast to what? Don't be so afraid to be specific, Eric.

Apparently, Eric is quite afraid.

Eric Stevens
I've got nothing to be afraid of.